| Author | some doubt about damage |
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| max attack points expert defense and max defense points expert offense, which one get higher damage and less suffering? :) |
| Topic moved from "General game forum" to "Queries and help". |
Based on the Rules of damage and healing https://www.lordswm.com/help.php?section=34
If we ignore faction resistances included in the computations described there, each points of the difference between an attacking creature's attack and a defending creature's defense accounts for a 5% change in damage.
So, if attack is equal to defense, no change.
If attack is 26 and defense is 22, attack is bigger by 4 points, so 4x5=20% more damage dealt.
If attack is 12 and defense is 15, defense is bigger by 3 points, 3x5=15% less damage dealt.
Expert offense means 30% increased MELEE damage. So it is like adding 6 attack whenever attacking melee.
Expert defense means 30% reduced MELEE damage. So it is like adding 6 defense whenever being attacked melee.
It is up to you decide which way you attack more or expect to be attacked more in order to decide what is best for your scenario.
I am working on a tool to help you simulate damage dealt between two creature stacks based on their hero configurations (attributes/items/talents and other) for this exact purpose, though not ready yet. |
each points of the difference between an attacking creature's attack and a defending creature's defense accounts for a 5% change in damage.
Well, 5% is best case scenario, less if defense is higher than attack.
If attack is 12 and defense is 15, defense is bigger by 3 points, 3x5=15% less damage dealt.
Actually, about 13%, but close enough. |
for DarkSooth:
thx for reply,
the Rules of damage and healing didnt talk about effect of talent
so i think maybe Damage = N * R(min, max) * [1 + 0,05 (A-D) ] * [1 - 3*Y/100]*(1+10%*offense level of you)*(1-10%*defense level of target)*(1+x%enchant)*(1-y%enchant of target), not simply adding 6 attack whenever attacking melee.
its still a guess, didnt make any test yet :) |
| (1+10%*offense level of you)*(1-10%*defense level of target) or (1+10%offense level-10%defense level) im not sure, but of couse the result would be different |
| Of course if the talent only effects melee damage it would depend on army makeup :) |
Expert offense means 30% increased MELEE damage. So it is like adding 6 attack whenever attacking melee.
I think it is not quite correct? Talent is applied separately, so if you have 4 extra attack points and expert offence, you'll have an increase of (1.2*1.3=1.56) or 56% percent in total. |
Well, 5% is best case scenario, less if defense is higher than attack.
Actually, each extra point of defence increases creature's 'effective HP' by 5%.
For example, if a creature has 20 extra defence, it would increase the 'effective HP' by 100%. It means that it can take same amount of hits as a creature with double hit points, but zero extra defence. |
To provide a concrete example:
Let's say an imaginary creature has 1-1 damage, 1 attack and no retaliation.
Then it would take the same amount of turns to kill a stack of 45 peasants (45*4=180 total HP, 1 defence) as to kill a cavalier (90 hp, 21 defence, 180 'effective HP'). |
(1+10%*offense level of you)*(1-10%*defense level of target) or (1+10%offense level-10%defense level) im not sure, but of couse the result would be different
Okay, I've searched on the russian forum, and people say that the first case is correct. So a stack with expert offence attacking a stack with expert defence results in (1+0.3)*(1-0.3)=0.91 or 91% damage dealt. |
Let's see:
Character 1 (my defensive build): 25 attack, 57 defence, expert defence
Character 2 (my offensive build): 44 attack, 38 defence, expert offence
1 attacking 2:
1/(1 + 0.05*(38-25)) = 1/1.65 ~ 60% damage
2 attacking 1:
1/(1 + 0.05*(44-57)) = 1/1.65
1/1.65 * (1 + 0.3) * (1 - 0.7) ~ 55% damage
So defence perk is sligtly better (however it is also more expensive). As for stats, it doesn't really make any difference, as long as the total is the same. |
I made a couple typos (the calculation itself is still correct though).
(44-57)
here, it is 57-44.
(1 - 0.7)
and here, it is 1 - 0.3
As a bonus, mirror builds:
1 attacking 1:
1/(1+0.05*(57-25)) = 1/2.6 ~ 38.5%
1/2.6 * (1 - 0.3) ~ 27% damage
2 attacking 2:
(1 + 0.05 * (44-38)) * (1 + 0.3) = 1.69 or 169% damage |
for D-i-a-b-l-O:
thanks for your test, i think its quite clear now :)
maybe expert offence max defense build would be a bit better, becouse of less range dam suffering,expecially for barbs and tribal |
| closed by Meshy (2019-01-22 15:23:55) |
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