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| Author | [I10E10A10W10] or [E10A10W10F10] |
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Once again, Search lets me down, so I couldn't find the thread where someone worked out the math. I'm sure I can reproduce the math, but I just don't feel like spending the time.
What I do remember is that you don't need to sweat about which one is better, F10 or I10. The difference, in most cases, is very small. I'd recommend that you do whichever enchantment is cheaper for you, or whichever you happen to have elements for. | | [E10A10W10F10] | Heh, I 10 is especially useful against Wizards and Knights ;)
Do what you can afford, or save up for I10 ^^ | | On a related note, which weapon (regardless of combat lvl) is best to do your 1st enchant on? Steel or Mithril Boots, Platemail, Dragon Shield, Steel Helmet, Light mithril coif or...? | | Jedi for your sake I would say Sword of Might. | If you plan to use your enchanted art often, then definitely Sword of might. High durability, low repair cost.
If you want to have the best possible and you're not concerned about gold, then go for Mithril longsword. | Care to elaborate? Thanks ;)
probably he mean that for ignore defence to be more effective than extra 10% elemental damage the target actually have to have more than 20 defence.
napkin maths.
10E10A10W -> 30% damage increase, so 1 damage would resuld in 1.3 damage
adding 10F -> 1.4 damage, or a relative augment of 7.6% extra damage
Now, on ignore defense, the effect of it is variable depending on how much the difference between attack and defense is.
Semplyfing the formula quite a bit, let's watch just the componend [A-D]
if A > D then
extra damage = 0.05*[A-d]
else ( if D>A)
damage = damage/[1+(0.05*(D-A))]
.
let's tabulate it, i'll make it a 4 column table:
column 1: relative attack( where for istance -X mean the defence is X higher than attack, +X mean attack is Xhigher than defence)
column 2,3,4: effect of ignore defence if target defence is 20,30,40
or, in other words, column 2 3 4 mean the % of damage increase at various level of defence
///continuing on another post | A B C D
-4 12.5 18.7 25.0
-3 11.7 17.6 23.5
-2 11.1 16.6 22.2
-1 10.5 15.7 21.0
0 10.0 15.0 20.0
+1 9.5 14.2 19.0
+2 9.0 13.6 18.1
+3 8.6 13.0 17.3
+4 8.3 12.5 16.6
this apply to the first half of the formula, so if there is already 10E10A10W this would mean comparing the 7.6% damage of moving from 1*1.3 to 1*1.4
with what X*1.3 to Y*1.3 would be
using 3 examples from the previous table for espliciteness.
target defense is 4 higher than the attack parameter
this mean the "base" factor is 0.8*1.3 = 1.04 damage
adding ignore defence, case 1 target defense is 20, end result defense is 2 higehr than attack, damage is 0.9*1.3 = 1.17 (12.5% increase)
same scenario, target defense is 30, end result defense is 1 higher than attack, damage is 0.95*1.3 = 1.235 (18.7% increase)
same scenario, target defense is 40, end result defense is same as attack, damage is 1*1.3= 1.3 ( 25% increase)
same scenario, we use fire enchant instead of ignore defence, end result is 0.8*1.4 = 1.12 (7.6% increase).
Let's use a more realisting scenario.
i browsed a high level pvp combat, lot of DE, let's watch the hated shrews attacking other shrews :P
we have an attack parameter of 37 against a defense parameter of 22
this mean the base damage is 1.75*1.3=2.275 damage coefficent ( an attack dealing 1000 base damage will deal 2275 damage)
1.75 is 1+(0.05*[37-22])
1.3 is 10E10W10A
if we add 10F the result is 1.75*1.4=2.45 damage coefficent (an attack dealing 1000 base damage will deal 2450 damage, or a 7.6% increase)
if we add 10I the result is 1.85*1.3=2.405 damage coefficent (an attack dealing 1000 base damage will deal 2405 damage or a 5.7% increase)
the result are further morphed depending on how offence talents interact with these( ie multiplicative with existing factor or additive on one of them) | for Omega22 & gem85.
Thanks. :) | #28
You have the right idea, but your calculations are way off. | for ciopo: ur maths are very good. Are u a uni student or mathematician? ^^. It's statistic maths. I did it 2 years ago. ^^
You guys are right. I know that depend on the situation, we have a better effective from these elements.
I just wonder which one do you like most!
(^0^)
Thanks for all the reply!!!
Keep telling us your opinion!!! | You have the right idea, but your calculations are way off.
and you totally demostrated it | to gem85 #85
what about theft dagger? | We can work with the formulas to figure out, for a given Defense, what Attack will yield more damage with F10 than with I10.
Because we have 2 different formulas for damage, depending on whether A>D or A<D, we will have 3 sets of inequality:
Case 1, A >= D: 1.4 * (1 + 0.05(A - D)) >= 1.3 * (1 + 0.05(A - 0.9D))
Case 2, 0.9D < A < D: 1.4 / (1 + 0.05(D - A))) >= 1.3 * (1 + 0.05(A - 0.9D))
Case 3, A <= 0.9D: 1.4 / (1 + 0.05(D - A) >= 1.3 / (1 + 0.05(0.9D - A))
In each case, the left side of the inequality represents the damage done by A10E10W10F10, and the right side by I10A10E10W10. Note that the extra damage due to faction level is ignored, since it's the same factor on both sides of the inequalities.
For simplicity, I'm going to ignore case 2, because it represents a value narrow set of value pairs (A,D). For example, if D = 20, then A = 19. If D = 30, then A = 28,29.
So, simplifying the inequalities yields:
Case 1: A >= 2.3D - 20
Case 3: A <= -0.4D + 20
This means, for example, that for D = 20, F10 will do better damage if A > 26 (from the first inequality), or if A < 12 (from the second inequality).
Now, armed with these two inequalities, we can create a table with 3 columns, D, AH, and AL, where D = Defense value of oppoent, AH = Attack value above which F10 will do better damage, and AL = Attack value below which F10 will do better damage.
D AH AL
<15 all all
15 all 14
16 16.8 13.6
20 26 12
25 37.5 10
30 49 8
35 60.5 6
40 72 4
Basically, if Defense is 15 or less, F10 is always better. For Defense 16 and higher, there's an expanding window of Attack wherein I10 will be better. The most common range of Defense encountered is 25 or less, in which case you nearly always have enough Attack to make F10 worthwhile. This is what I meant when I said that F10 is better in most cases. | for Mr_eee:
Thief dagger is good too, but I usually use the left hand slot to get a very cheap +3 def with Def shield.
Thief dagger has an even better repair cost/durability ratio than SoM when new.
But I still prefer using my SoM, as it has higher durability, so it lasts longer before repairing it becomes uneconomical, so my hard earned elements serve me longer. |
This topic is long since last update and considered obsolete for further discussions.
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